YFM350 camshaft engine rebuild

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crazy2jerry

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I have a like new White brothers camshaft wb #1905 99 which is the same camshaft as Webcams 17/88mc grind (They made it for white brothers
.440 lift 254 [email protected] intake
.390 lift 244 [email protected] exhaust
106 lobe centers Can anybody get the opening and closing specs??
I called web cams and the white brothers camshaft is the same cam they sell as 17/88mc. This camshaft is listed as a top end cam with high compression piston, exhaust. I can't get a straight answer as to the perfomance of camshaft.. The Girl at webcams said it falls between the 88mc( .390 and the 84mc( .430 in perfomance wise...
Has anyone tried the wed camshaft 17/88mc (.440-.390)lift (254-244 duration) grind???? Any numbers on the simulator??? I just can't get a good answer to my question from the people at webcams... I really don't want to tear my bike down as it runs good now.. And I really don't want a top end only machine.. But a cam in between the .390 and .430 would be a GREAT CAMSHAFT!!!!!!!
Anyboby have any experience in this?????? Please???
I have everything to redo the engine wiseco 83.50 piston & cyclinder, Kibblewhite valve springs and the camshaft.....
I just don't want to put a camshaft thats all topend and make the warrior a hard machine to ride.. I like hill climbing and trail riding and maybe a sand dune or 2... The .430 web maybe a better cam.. But I'm hoping this would be right between the to .430 and .390 HELP HELP HELP!!!!
 
yea i had this cam before my cam bearing failure last time and the cam ate into the head. this cam liked the top end a lot more than the bottom end. the cam i have now is the 88 grind but they put like a 5 degree advance timing on it so it does not fall on its face on the top end. the cam i have now seems like it has more torque but less horsepower than the "white brothers" cam. the white brothers cam was pretty fun on the top end, but i wanted a more torquie motor and i called web cam and they said the 88 grind would be perfect but i didnt want the top end to fall off to bad compared to what i had so they said they could put that advance timing in it. right now the 88 grind pretty much has a lot more torque and is what i want. hope this helps, hard to explain everything i stated.
 
Thanks for the info. I have a question though. Did they grind the cam with the 5 degress advance or did you get the ajustustable cam gear??? With the cam gear you could advance or retard the cam to change the power band....

Thanks
Jerry
 
yea they said they were going to grind it because i ordered it on a monday, then on friday they called and said they finished it and were going to send it out. i do not have an adjustable cam gear on it. but that would make sense to do it, unless they only changed on lobe. i really did not understand but i told them what i wanted and they said they could do that for me so the top end wasnt lazy. i know the top end does not perform like the white brothers cam did, but it still revs out more than stock and has a lot more torque.
 
Ok teck questions.
In the auto world advancing a cam gives more bottom end but you loose it off top end.. Retard and a cam looses some bottom end but give more top end...
the 17/88mc webcam has the following spec.
Int open 19^btdc Int close 59^ abdc. Exh open 52^ bbdc exh colse 12^ atdc 31^ degress overlap 110 lobe centers.. .440int .390exh lift.
The .390(88) has 102 int 106 exh. centerlines for a 104 centerline 36^ overlap
The .430 (84) has 102 int 106 exh. centerlines for a 104 centerline 50^ overlap
So the 17/88 has the least overlap at 31^ so it should loose less compression with the int and exh valves being open at the same time. But having a 110-112 lobe center gives broader power, but less peak. 104-108 gives a higher peak but has a very narrow power ban and looses power on the bottom end..
So i called webcams and the girl sayed this cam would be right in between the .390 and .430 Great thats what I want.. But there description say's different.. So if I put in an adjustable cam gear 5^ advance would I get closer to the low end power of the .390 (88) and still have the power on top end??? I'm not going to take the engine past 9500rpm anyway..
Anybody run this combo on a dyno simulator for me????
Mind you I alredy have the 17/88 .440/.390 cam and have a .390 (88) cam on the way... I'm just trying to get the most out of my machine.. I don't want to spend a lot of time trying both cams..

I have too install at the same time a wiseco 83.50mm piston, 400z carb.
Already have whitebros r4 full exhaust uni-filter 152 main jet on stock engine.. It will whillie in 2nd gear with me riding sitting on the seat just pulling back on handle bars. It has 14/40 sprockets 22" tires and will beat all of my friend warriors in a drag race easy!!!!! I want more power but not yfz450 type power.. I have a big bear oil cooler set up to install on it too.

Anbody chime in on the power of where and how these cams perform and if this cam will work for the perfomance I'm looking for... I would of went with the 84 .430 cam but I think it might be to much and the mega .450 is out of the question.. but something in between is the goal..

Thanks ;D :D :cool:
 
Ok guys i've ran the 3 cam specs threw the engine simulator I have and they're all so close only 3 hp ontop end above 7200 rpm. But the stock cam given the specs in the camshaft spec section always has more torque and hp till 7200 rpm. The other 3 make more hp on top above 7000rpm and more torque but only a little.. So the stock cam makes in the simulator way more bottom end torque till 6200rpm than any of the webcams.. Hp only starts to improve above 6500rpm. at 8000 rpm it can be 4-6hp but only at 7500 plus rpm.... what em I missing here????? Are the webcams just more responsive to throttle because unless your hammering it they seem laking????
Thanks
 
so you ordered both cams? i have a brand new megacycle .450 cam that i never installed and i have been itching to install it but im also a little afraid to. i would really like to try megacycles .395//415 cam so see what it has. i just want a very torquie motor, one when you jab the throttle is just pulls hard and wants to pull the wheels off the ground. i guess to really do that, a stoker kit is needed, but i dont have that kind of funds at the moment.

i know the cam i have hits very good in the mid range and will break the tires loose in gravel and doesnt want to wheelie because i cant get traction but out on the road i cant get it to pull the front end up. i would love to ride another warrior thats build so see how mine compares.
 
I wouldn't all myself a cam tech savy guy by any means and a lot of this info I get but at the same time is going over my head. I can tell you that I'm currently running the PowerRoll .430 cam and the I wish there was more lower end/torque. It really acts like a powerband though, once mid throttle hits it really takes off. Main disappointment thus far is the need to feather clutch on hills if I'm attempting on an idle. Id be really interested to run a .390 cam in it just to see the difference but I'm not to upset with my decision enough to tear it all down again and do the switch......if any of that info helps. Keep in mind my JE 11:1 piston on a 84.5 bore mild P&P job and Edlebrock carb setup as well.
 
yea i get what you mean deadlast, i dont know much about cam tech or even what different mods will do much, but slowly learning. thats why i never stuck that megacycle .450 cam in, because im afraid it will have a powerband that i will not like. i know with the .390 i can lug it pretty good, and mid throttle is where it loves to be and where it for it just has a huge hit there. im also running 14/40 gearing with22" tires. i thought about gearing it faster because i can shift through the gears and run out pretty quick and by gearing it higher i think it will be in its power range longer with less shifting.
 
crazy2jerry said:
Ok guys i've ran the 3 cam specs threw the engine simulator I have and they're all so close only 3 hp ontop end above 7200 rpm. But the stock cam given the specs in the camshaft spec section always has more torque and hp till 7200 rpm. The other 3 make more hp on top above 7000rpm and more torque but only a little.. So the stock cam makes in the simulator way more bottom end torque till 6200rpm than any of the webcams.. Hp only starts to improve above 6500rpm. at 8000 rpm it can be 4-6hp but only at 7500 plus rpm.... what em I missing here????? Are the webcams just more responsive to throttle because unless your hammering it they seem laking????
Thanks
Click to expand...


Simulators can really only tell you one side of the story. Also the data you put is must be correct other wise your output will be not be right. So don't get to wrapped up into it.

From what I've found is that yes the stock cam will have more torque and straight low end power. Granted the mid and top end fall short big time in compared to other cams out there.

Two cams I've tried.
The .390" is a great cam. Good all around power. Has good torque and hp all the way through the power band. From the sim I found it had the most all around power average and torque then all the cams on this list.

.450" awesome mid and top. Little lazy on the bottom end around 2500 rpm and below. Once you get past that, look the **** out. Feels like it out pulls the .390 every where else. Very fun cam just because of the pull it gives you.
Sim said has least amount of torque on the bottom and highest hp other then the powroll race .430

After trying both I pick the .450" even though the simluator spec's tell me the .390 is better.

When picking a cam it is always give and take. I think changing cams is pretty easy. All you have to do is buy the bearing so you can just slap one in and take the other out.
 
Ok this is the kind of info I was looking for..This is why I joined this site for the good info and responses. If I choose the webcams .430 (84) grind how would it compare to the megacycles .450 cam??? The mega .450 lookings to be a little more than I need but if the .430 (84) is just a little tamer than the .450 it would work for me.. Talked to webcams and I can have them regrind the 17/88mc cam to a 250 intake duration vs the 258 it has now with a .420 lift instead of the .440 lift.. Or a .390 (88) cam as it already has the 244 duration .390 lift of the (88) on the exhaust for $70.00. What do you think?? I could just sell the cam also and use the money to buy a .430 (84) cam..
Thanks
Jerry
 
jason, i have really thought about throwing in that .450 megacycle cam. all i would need is the bearing and a new cam gear bolt right? then just pull the old one out, put the new one in, install the cam gear and chain, and adjust the rockers right? do i need anything else for the .450 cam, like maybe the adjustable cam sprocket?
 
crazy2jerry said:
Ok this is the kind of info I was looking for..This is why I joined this site for the good info and responses. If I choose the webcams .430 (84) grind how would it compare to the megacycles .450 cam??? The mega .450 lookings to be a little more than I need but if the .430 (84) is just a little tamer than the .450 it would work for me.. Talked to webcams and I can have them regrind the 17/88mc cam to a 250 intake duration vs the 258 it has now with a .420 lift instead of the .440 lift.. Or a .390 (88) cam as it already has the 244 duration .390 lift of the (88) on the exhaust for $70.00. What do you think?? I could just sell the cam also and use the money to buy a .430 (84) cam..
Thanks
Jerry
Click to expand...

Personally I would go with a .430 if you want something a little tamer then the .450. That cam showed almost as much torque as there .390" cam but more top end hp. Granted like I said it is give and take. You have to give up a little on the bottom to gain some top end. It is just the way this motor is.
I wouldn't mess around with custom grindings as really you don't know what it will turn out to be.
If you want all out torque and low end I would go with .415
They do sell adjustable cam gears and it does work good if you want to shift the power around but honestly don't worry about it. It will maybe shift the power band by 500 rpm one way or the other. That is what I've found with my setup.
 
91warrior said:
jason, i have really thought about throwing in that .450 megacycle cam. all i would need is the bearing and a new cam gear bolt right? then just pull the old one out, put the new one in, install the cam gear and chain, and adjust the rockers right? do i need anything else for the .450 cam, like maybe the adjustable cam sprocket?
Click to expand...

The bolt doesn't really need to be replaced just make sure to put some thread locker on it (red). It would be cheap to get a new one though if you felt like you should. I know web recomends it but I've used my over a couple times now with no problems.
Na you don't need a adjustable cam sprocket. It will only help if you want to shift the power band a couple hundred rpm's one way or the other.
I personally would try this cam just to see what you think. I will be interested.
Also you will find that you will have to go up 2 sizes on the main and out on the pilot because of how much larger and more power this cam makes then your web.
More compression you are running the bigger cam you can get away with running and still have bottom end power and also helps make the cam "work" better.
This is what some engine builders try to hide or not want to many people to know. . .
 
Jason, Who that you know of offers the .415 cam? That could be interesting!
 
megacycle has a .415 intake/ .395 exhaust cam called 252-x2. the .450 is the 252-x1. i would love to try that .415, and from what jason said, that cam would probably have exactly what i am lookin for, low end and torque. but curiosity has got me since i already have the .450 cam sitting in a on a desk brand new, and all i need to buy to swap it in is bearing. but if i could, i would trade even up for a .415 cam if i could.

now jetting for a different cam on an edelbrock would mostly consist of adjusting the acc. pump screw, maybe change the needle, and turn the needle to the right hight, right?

deadlast, got to www.megacyclecams.com then click on download catalog and then go to page 59 to see the cams they have for warriors and the .415 cam specs.
 
Ok so I'm going to sell the web 17/88mc grind cam. I already have the 88mc .390 grind. Should I sell it and get the 84 .430 grind or em I just now slpitting hairs??? Also have an early supertrapp with 4" disks (8) looks like dg. My bike has the whitebros. R-4 full exhaust.. Works awsome.. Stock engine beats other piped warriors & k&n filtered engines. I'm looking to get a little more perfomance out of it... 84 or 88 grind webcam, Wiseco 84mm piston ltz 400 carb , uni-filter, modified lid and said exhaust.. Also big bear oil cooler setup... Have another warrior to get all my old good parts for my son...
What do you think here guys???
Thanks
Jerry
 
why are you selling the 17/88 cam? what kind of powerband are you looking for. if your happy with your 88 grind, i would just keep that in. the reason im looking at changing mine is for more torque and out of curiosity of trying the .450 that i have
 
deadlastracing said:
Jason, Who that you know of offers the .415 cam? That could be interesting!
Click to expand...

CWR racing. Talk to Greg. Also you can call Megacycle direct but I don't believe they take CC. You may have to do a COD from the last time I checked. Also Duncan racing sells them.

Yeah the .415" is all out torque. You will be short shifting to keep that baby in the power. Great for woods riding for sure!
Easy way to tell how much torque or hp (high rpm or low) a cam has is how much overlap it has. Less a cam has more low end torque. More, High rpm power.
 
Forgot to say dead that you have the all out racing custom grind powroll cam. Basically that is a top end cam that likes to be reved.
 
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